LPhillips wrote:I thought it went without saying that 10 points couldn't cost 10 leadership points. But I guess it bears pointing out. I would imagine that it would cost more like 5 to 8 points, leaving the opportunity to purchase some practical abilities as well.
Also, please consider the addition of more powerful and effective Ambush units in the future, or even simply the reinstatement of our previously good Ambush units. That is the point. Not just balancing it around Ghost stacks or Ghost+Eagle/Wolfrider now (which are in fact a real and present danger in many games, especially with fast movement, moderate upkeep, moderate investment, versatile employment, and high effect on strong stacks).
We can't balance Ambush around using it to break down cities, no matter how fond we are of doing it. It's not intended for that. If anything, we must push for a more effective siege weapon or combat system, rather than gimping normal combat balance to fill the hole. I admit there's a need, but Ambush isn't a solution.
I agree with all these statements. I especially agree with the idea of needing something else besides ambush to break down really strong cities. As long as something like that comes into the game then Ambush isn't going to be needed for that role and it can go back to it's intended role of killing/damaging hero stacks and power stacks.
But do you really think Group Warding needs to go 40/50/60/70 (at L4) to be useful vs my preference of 20/35/50/65? My fear is that 40% will be more than enough Warding for 90% of the cases (other than an Assassin with 70% in a city with more than 8 defenders) leaving the Ranger to spend all their level up points on AA/Leadership so that you end up with a Ranger at L4 with 40% Ward/10AA/+12 in Forest/Swamp (or +20 in one). On many maps that's going to be a killer hero even against cities full of Gryphons/GD's/Demons. On the other hand if you start the Ward at 20 you make them spend at couple of level ups to reach 50 so that at L4 they are 50 Ward with 1 level up to spend on AA/Leadership as needed.
As far as higher individual ambush on some units, lets worry about that when it happens (I think the current 70% cap and individual unit ambushes for the Medusa/Ghost/Wolfrider/Orc seem right other than the Orc probably needs to rise to 10 ambush and 10 strength). The game can always add a new unit with high individual warding (say 50) to balance that so you have another option besides Rangers.
Your comments on purchasing a level 3 and then directly employing it as a +20 leadership unit brings up a separate but important issue: without the need to level new heroes, without the opportunity cost and required stratagem, how can abilities like this be balanced? If I can purchase a hero (very randomly, which makes it even worse) and immediately use it with +20 morale against your stack standing on the appropriate terrain in the same turn, how can that ever be balanced? Anti-Morale will have to be as common as Ambush, and these hard-to-level but situationally strong heroes will still be gamebreakers.
I could see only allowing hero offers in Capitols, but that doesn't fully alleviate the problem. That moves heroes toward the point of being only marginally involved in the real conflicts, without helping with their easily overpowering stature on the battlefield. Alternately, a level 2 or 3 hero could always come with their own native skillset, preventing imbalance. For example: A level 3 Ranger always has +12 in each terrain bonus. Ability points might still be accessible to the player. A level 3 Valkeria can't come pre-loaded with +14 Attack bonus, can she?
A L3 Valkyrie comes with +10, not +14 but I know what you meant. A HL can come with +15 in one of his terrains at L3.
I've thought about this for a while actually. It's going to be way overpowering to have a random hero show up especially the specialized ones who might immediately swing a game with a +15 type bonus along with any allies the might come with. My thought is this. Even though you purchase the hero at L2-L4, the hero only comes at L1. Then on the next turn you get +1000XP to reach L2, the following turn another +1000 to reach L3 and then the turn after that +1500 (I think it's 1500 to get to L4). Thus it takes 2-4 turns for the hero to fully get to the level you purchased them at. This prevents game breaking heroes from appearing in front line cities while most of the time you'll be moving toward the lines and leveling during your movement there. In the mean time the hero could still level up from normal game XP during those turns, they would just get the +X added at the start of the next few turns.
Edit: KGB, There's also an increasing return for higher Warding skill. Especially when it is applied pre-cap, and especially if more strong Ambush units are ever to be present in the game. This also should go without saying. 70% Group Warding is over 100% more effective than 40% Group Warding. Being a big math guy, you'll appreciate that.
Isn't 70% exactly 100% more effective? Eg. 100% ambush X 70% ward = 30% ambush. 100% ambush X 40% ward = 60% ambush. 30 vs 60 = 100% more effective.
Again I claim 40% would be more than enough for 90% of the time in the game. You really only need higher than 40 against high level Assassin heroes or stacks of 6-8 Ghosts. I don't want L1 heroes having all the Warding they need.
KGB